[komek58]

alright so i just put some enkei 16's on and the front wheels have a negative camber, not too bad, but to the point where i'm going to get tire wear, and i dont really want that right now. i bought the car stock, and i looked like it was lowered a little bit, but the owner didnt know. there is not kit on it, or any suspension upgrade, and i cant tell if the springs were cut.

1. should i get a camber kit to fix the camber in the front?

2. it no, then what do i need to do/get to get this fixed?

3. if a camber kit is needed, what and where, i shop for all my aftermarket parts on modacar.com, and all the kits and suspesion is for civics.

i would post pictures, but my dad's got the car right now taking it to the honda dealer. seatbelt was broken when i got it, so i took it out, and now some people in japan are searching europe for a seatbelt to ship me, since its all waranteed yah know, gotta love honda

thanks

 

[tyson]

you wont need a camber kit. just get an alignment to set the toe.

the only "debate" of camber and toe tire wear is between those who understand tires and suspension and those who dont.

negative camber isnt a significant factor in tire wear. despite the seemingly obvious connection. tires wear by the amount of slip the rubber goes through as it transitions to and from contact with the pavement as it rolls. an incorrect toe setting will cause the tire to slip more, like the car was constantly turning as the tire shifts in direction between ground contact and back. an extreme example of tire slip in the fore-aft direction is doing a burnout. the effects of tire slip to tire wear is easy to comprehend. the same thing goes on in the lateral direction when the tire is forced to "turn" or twist at every revolution.

severe camber will not affect the tire slip nearly as much as it simply is flattening out in the normal direction a tire is designed to compress with no more tire slip than a regularly rolling tire. perhaps more on one side than the other. but consider also that the sidewalls flex and for most allowable camber angles still produce a contact patch full across the tread. even then, consider that a regular tire should last 30-60 thousand miles, especially if just rolling straight.

hondas in particular those with double wishbone suspension specifically control camber angles better than other cars and is also the reason why camber really isnt in need of "correction". in fact, negative camber is a good thing and to take away from it would take away from the great handling already designed in the suspension.

when a car is lowered, the ride height changes. when the ride height changes, the camber changes. when the camber changes, the toe changes. (it doesnt work in reverse) this is designed in the double wishbone suspension for better handling in the corners as the outside tire is loaded. therefore, when the ride height changes, the toe changes. and so the toe should be fixed.

for those who just put camber kits on after lowering, and then adjust them back to positive, also adjusted the toe back. so as a result, benefited in tire wear because the toe was changed closer to where it was previously. not because the camber was changed. even with a camber kit, a full alignment is still recommended, as theres no way to really to know where the camber or alignment really is. and its nonetheless important.

the only exception to the benefit of leaving negative camber is for those interested in maximizing straight line grip, as in drag racing. then you want as straight of a contact patch as possible, or something.

 

[mattminerDOTcom]

wow, um, that statement needs to be like a quick response key for camber question shaha.

[email protected]

 

[komek58]

wow thanks man

that leaves me seechless

and yeah that should be a sticky or something

the thing is, the toe is set to OEM, just got alignment the day i bought the car,
but according to you the small negative camber is ok? i think its fine, i just dont want bad tire wear, you know?

 

[shorte]

Yeah.. everthing Tyson said.
So the car is at the same hight as when you got it, then you had an alignment done, No changes after that right? Then your good.
And seatbelts are covered under warranty for life.

 

[downest]

Adding to the FAQ!

 

[komek58]

alright heres the order

1. bought car, suspicion of car lowered some how, not really sure though

2. alignment done

3. stock wheels and tires replaced by enkeis and low profiles, which were about an inch lower than the stock side by side

so i guess it should be alright, i'm going to have to check the springs to make sure they didnt cut them.

 

[komek58]

and the dealership just called back, word from japan is they wont get a seatbelt to me until august 7th....ESTIMATE.............grr

so...my seatbelt only restracts the waste part, not the shoulder part.

 

[tyson]

i would get an alignment whenever i put new tires on.

or at least check them at home.
http://www.crxcommunity.com/viewtopic.php?t=7123

toe should be set to regular specs, basically zero.

 

[komek58]

well this was all in a matter of hours in the same day, straight from the alignment shop to the tires and wheels shop

 

[tyson]

then youre fine. you should have done it the other way around tho. new wheels and tires shouldnt change toe. (i havent verified this personally tho)

 

[Baker]

Good explaination.

It helped me out in understanding the whole camber discussion/debate,/myth a lot better.

 

[91crx_83]

I know this thread is old as hell but sense ppl like nit picking posts around here please please explian this so called slip you speak of cuz the last time I checked in the automotive and commercial truck field it was refered to as scrub not slip for many reasons

1. Slip as in having NO traction between rotating wheel and ground

2. Scrub the reaction when trying to move a tire in a straight line while the front is off set from the rear of the tire which in turn causes accelerated wear of the tires

Now lets say that you were on ice being pulled by a vehicle and you shoes are the "tire" , your saying that the "slip" will cause accelerated wear of you "tires" but that seems sceintificly improbable do to the very low traction the ice has i.e. little friction

Now lets put you on a dry asphalt condition and you "tires" are scrubbing the ground the dry asphalt provides high friction there for accelerated wear of your "tires"

I'm not claiming to be a Auto wiz or anything but if you gonna put the info out there at least put it in the correct fasion and word useage

 

[tyson]

oh i get it, mr. jersey shore wants to shift the conversation of "camber wear" to this thread.

im a fan of technical semantics. but like shock vs strut, its not a big deal, you can call it whatever you want. slip, scrub, slide, whatever.

the term slip for me comes from tire discussions of "slip angles". thats where the tires tread is being forced at an angle against the normal angle of the wheel. to a certain point, a greater slip angle provides more traction, UNTIL it loses ultimate adhesion and you are sliding off into the grass or worse... its a racing term, perhaps not an every day mechanic term.

i dont understand your analogy of ice vs slip. im not talking about low coefficients of friction, or sliding on grease or something.

if "scrub" is the term youd like to use for you to better understand why tires wear due to bad toe and not camber, thats cool with me. it doesnt change anything i said....

i love correct FASHION and word USAGE! :bounce:

 

[Thrashy]

The terminology is at least partially interchangeable, since one leads to the other: when a tire is rolling at a high slip angle, it will experience scrubbing. To be fair, though, I tend to see "slip" come up more in the context of vehicle dynamics than tire wear, and vice-versa for "scrub."

 

[DKCRX]

mines sitting on stock shocks with eibach sports line.. i can tell it has negative camber..

i will be getting kyb agx and 15in rims soon... i guess the question is...

will i need to get camber kit when im doing the alignment? or no....?

 

[hacksparrow]

15's would be like 195 or 205/50 which is thick enough to negate any tire wear when you get an alignment

 

[MexiChriS]

15's would be like 195 or 205/50 which is thick enough to negate any tire wear when you get an alignment

Yeah my Enkei EK90 rims are 15's and tires are 195

 

[JDMCrx91]

Lol no need for a camber kit. Front negative camber is always good for cornering, track use. Like ppl said TOE its tires not CAMBER. Im actually gonna be running around -2 to - 3 front camber on my daily crx.
One more thing im running 15x8 205 tires and I got maybe -5 or so camber on the rear. Ran the car for a year and tires still good. How about that.

 

[MexiChriS]

That's good info JDMCrx91