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think this is a good buy?
No.

Purchase an Ingalls Balljoint. Thats the only way to do it cleanly. It requires that you have the 90-91 upper control arms in your car, and if you don't, then you'll need to hit up a Junkyard or MattMiner :)lol:), and see if either has a pair.

imHo, that is the only way to go with these cars for camber correction. Unfortunately, I don't sell Ingalls anymore due to toher reasons, so i can't get you a 'hook up', but search eBay, and you'll find them there for a really good price.

Oh, and while you are looking at eBay, take some friendly advise... see a "balljoint" on there that is a ton cheaper, and looks like it does the same thing, but isn't Ingalls? DONT BUY IT! Don't be cheap here... lol! The internals of the Ingalls balljoint is actually made by the same company that makes the internals for your OEM balljoint... the others are not. This is an important component, don't risk your car over $20... If the $20 is going to break you, then you prolly ought-not be modifying cars ;)
 

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yeha ive got plenty of 90-91 style upper control arms, ready to have their worn and abused all joints swapped with a fresh adjustable ingalls unit haha. how could you guess? (believe it or not my pars upply is shrinking rapidly)

The only question I have for you though, is do you really want to fix your camber? Camber is a bonus to lowering your car, not a negative side effect. Ive been considering getting something that would allow me to go more negative actually for race days.

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also, i dont mess with supension parts and quality....this is not like a nissan or a subie or something, if we lose a ball joint chances are your car is done.

my friend had a known bad lower ball joint go on his car at like 45mph. The wheel ripped ocmpletely off and tore up the whole car basically. He was lucky to not get seriously injured.

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I didn't realize that there was a difference between 88-89 and 90-91 front upper control arms.... otherwise I would have grabbed them off my old car.
ANyone mind telling me how they differ?
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
mattminerDOTcom said:
yeha ive got plenty of 90-91 style upper control arms, ready to have their worn and abused all joints swapped with a fresh adjustable ingalls unit haha. how could you guess? (believe it or not my pars upply is shrinking rapidly)

The only question I have for you though, is do you really want to fix your camber? Camber is a bonus to lowering your car, not a negative side effect. Ive been considering getting something that would allow me to go more negative actually for race days.

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i have a 1990. and yes i want to fix it cause its a dd but not all the way so when i take it to the track.

already ordered the ingalls
 

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the 88-89 style has non replaceable ball joints, they are welded in. I have ground? them out before, but it was not fun at all.
The 90-91 style has c clips. Take them of, wack it with a hammer, and the balljoint comes right out.

You say you want to fix it 'becuase it is a dd', but what are you trying to fix? is your camber so excessive you have tire wear or clearance issues? Thats what I was getting at. I run a significant amount of camber all day long with minimal camber wear.

If I had to ballpark it, Id say my inner tire is maybe 5 percent more worn then my outer over the last 15k miles since new. I actually shoul dmeasure it and see. The whole time Ive been over 2 degrees negative in the front (somtimes more). My toe and caster are dead nuts stock.

Good for ordering the ingalls, its a quality part. Ive just never seen camber as a bad thing, I dont know where this whole 'camber wear' myth came from. I see it as a prime reason to lower your car.

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This guy's rex is very low, not as low as Mr. Miner's experiment, but lower than Robb's.

I'd be worried about the axles and the stock shocks way before camber. I have my front wheels at -3.5 degrees, and they've been that way for 4 years. I bought adjustable balljoints a few years ago, but never installed them. I've since decided that I like having camber. The camber wear on the tires is minimal once the toe is corrected.
 

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jfro: what bad things happen to the shocks/axles when it is lowered like that??
 

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jfrolang said:
This guy's rex is very low, not as low as Mr. Miner's experiment, but lower than Robb's.
IMPOSSIBLE!

I'd be worried about the axles and the stock shocks way before camber. I have my front wheels at -3.5 degrees, and they've been that way for 4 years.
Same here, I have around 3 degrees in the front and have had no inner tire wear problems, just make sure the toe is set correctly (and caster if you have the ability to adjust it). I recently had to replace my Azenis RT-215 because they were finally too bald to drive on the street with, and they were evenly worn all across the tire.

The camber wear on the tires is minimal once the toe is corrected.
Doesn't that make it toe wear?
 

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Well, the wear on the inside of the tires that you get immediately after lowering is mostly toe wear I guess, but there is some camber wear too. It's enough to be noticeable after 10,000 miles on my front tires, but not enough to bother changing the camber. Just keep the tires rotated.
 

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Exactly, it's toe wear. Lowering causes toe-out and negative camber, the former is bad. I got 12k miles out of my RT-215s with that much negative camber, and until I ran them in the last autoX (the day they came off) with three drivers, they were even street legal still. I don't know anyone who got more than 10k out of a set, and I autocrossed quite a bit on them too.
 

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fyi, as for the "who cares about camber" thing... i'll take less camber over extreme negative camber ANY day... why? Well, you aren't running an autocross ALL the time, you have better forward-traction the more level your tires are to the ground, and cars with negative camber just LOOK bad...

But those are just my opinions ('cept for the traction thing, thats proven) 8)
 

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too clarify as well, im not saying that we should be running like -5 degrees haha.

I think that lowered between 1.5" and a littl eover 2" with between 2 and r degrees of negative camber is the way to go. Its easy on your other suspesnion parts (bushings, axles, etc) and is a proven combination.

if you are going to drag race, id set the camber to 0 for racing. Ive even heardof people setting the camber slight +

autox or track event you want a good amount of -

but hey, its all about what you want, its your car. All I know is that when other people AutoX my car, all I get is compliments.. Hopefully one day I can drive it as good as all these other people that seem to have no problem thrashing it around a course.

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
jfro the shocks were replaced in 99 with a fresh coat of paint and i guess the wear ive seen was toe. HOw can you fix that?

i still want to fix it cause there is a local track(drag) that i go to and have fun with some of my friends so its better to have 0.

Im not going to mess with the rear or should I?

And ive seen lower cars than mine plus i raised it bout an inch and some change since you saw it.
 

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toe is adjusted with your tie rods. The back you want a little less camber then the front. I relaly think you are not going to want 0 camber, youll want at least a bit - , if only a few tenths.

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