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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
As some of you may know, the Sanden TR70 is notoriously unreliable. I have been through about 5-6 AC jobs in the past few years on my 89 hatch due to repeated failures/issues with the TR70, all with R12. It has been an ongoing hassle with my car to have adequate AC. If any of you live in hot climates and have converted your CRX's to R134 you likely know how bad an R134 conversion sucks in these cars - especially at idle without a parallel flow condenser and the weak TR70. My brother and I have been on a mission for years now to get good AC systems in these cars. I even own a 50 pound R12 cylinder SPECIFICALLY just to maintain my EF AC system for as long as possible.

So I got this idea from user JMZ400 on H-T.com if any of you have seen that thread there. My brother and I finished this over the past two days on his CRX D15B2. His system now includes a new evaporator, new expansion valve, new drier, new parallel flow condenser, and new (aftermarket) Sanden TRS090 compressor. We made the custom AC hoses/lines ourselves using a factory EG Civic suction side compressor fitting, and the discharge side compressor fitting is from a 1997 CRV. Kudos to JMZ400 on this whole idea.

My brother's CRX was originally a Matsu****a equipped car. We used an aluminum EG VX compressor bracket (cut off the torque mount) along with a stock EF Matsu****a idler pulley. We used the factory EG compressor bracket bolts as well as factory EG compressor bolts. We suspect the stock Sanden idler pulley is identical and would also work but didn't care to test that out. The stock belt would not fit so we had to use a 32" belt.

We went to a fabric store and bought some foam to really seal up around the condenser, and then painted it black because who wants green foam showing through?

Onto the pics:



















Now - it was only about 70 degrees outside when we finished his car, so we're unable to get a true how-does-it-perform-in-the-middle-of-the-summer test. However, I just re-did my entire AC system in my own EF. I stayed R12 with the notoriously unreliable Sanden TR70.

So how about this for a comparison, my new OEM spec R12 sytem, at idle:



His CRX with the JMZ400 custom system and R134, at idle:



Very promising so far. Again this is a direct factory spec R12 car directly compared to this new hybrid R134 system, literally both sitting in the same driveway at the same time. It's supposed to get into the 80's next week so I will report back with performance updates. Even if this "only" operates on par with a factory R12 system that is still an upgrade just from the simple fact of getting away from the awful TR70.
 

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Very nice and inventive, McGyver. Another option would be to get a Denso 10PA 10 piston compressor from an SiR. You still need to get the compressor hoses because of the different flanges and think of some brackets since it came from a B16. The 10PA was used widely by brands like Mercedes well into the 00's and has no issues pumping R134a
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Put the car back together and got to actually drive it today. It was 79 degrees outside and 68% humidity.

Drove it around for about 15 minutes and it cycled between about 38 degrees and 42 degrees.

Stopped and idled for 5 minutes to simulate a long stoplight and/or drive through and this was the center vent reading after sitting there idling:



Almost wish it would hurry up and start getting into the 90's here already so we can realllllllllly test it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
5 oz of PAG and 29 oz of r134.

That's 29 oz by weight, using my 30 lb r134 cylinder and refrigerant scale. It's very difficult getting a precise weight using the individual cans
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Well, AC is easy. The hard part is AC that is actually cold and reliable. :shock:

Countless members in northern states and on the west coast get away with no AC whatsoever or with just putting R134 fittings onto their stock setup and shooting R134 into it. These types don't know what a truly hot summer is like (we are in Texas) and are baffled that an ordinary R134 conversion on these cars is woefully inadequate.

I drive my EF pretty much daily and my brother drives his CRX daily. My work commute has no highway whatsoever, and my EF has historically been so bad at idle/stop and go traffic that I can't even hardly go out to eat during the summer for lunch at work because my car has to sit in uncovered parking at work. So with the car already sitting in the sun all day, and with pretty much stop and go/city traffic during my lunch time commutes, I basically end up a sweaty pig in my long sleeve shirts and come back to the office looking like a fool. So it's pretty much relegated me to bringing my lunch all summer. Although my current R12 iteration seems to cool a little better than some previous setups so I shall see this summer how it works.

Anyway, as the temps warm up here I will update this thread periodically with performance comparisons between it and my R12 system.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Just want to update this to add some more info to the knowledge base. Two cars are now driving in and around Dallas with this setup. Today my brother and I and our buddy put this same setup in our buddy's 1990 Si hatchback.

Anyway, the interesting thing is that my buddy pulled the compressor mounting bracket from an EG at the junkyard a few weeks back. The car actually had a D16Y7 swap and neither me nor my buddy realized it at the time. So when we went to put the compressor mounting bracket in it today my brother realized it was actually an EK bracket and we were thinking "oh crap" as this was the only day we had to work on this and were potentially SOL without a bracket.

But turns out that thankfully the EK bracket bolts right up to the EF block and works just fine for this swap. Interestingly the EG and EK brackets look completely different yet evidently mount identically.

So to sum this up - this swap can be accomplished with the EK compressor bracket too. Here's the EK bracket and TRS090 on the 1990 Si we did today. The EK bracket is aluminum. This picture is with factory EK idler bracket/assembly, but the actual pulley itself is from his factory EF setup. The junkyard was trying to charge him $30 bucks for the EK assembly so he tossed it at the JY to save some money. We suspect the EK pulley is identical though.



 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
If you have the stock fan setup, the fans are "puller" fans, meaning the fans "pull" air through the condenser and radiator toward the engine. The fans are mounted directly to the backside of the radiator which allow them to "pull" air fairly forcefully through the radiator.

However, because the condenser is in FRONT of the radiator and is actually a few inches away from the radiator - without foam there to "seal" the condenser to the radiator your puller fans are basically unable to "pull" a decent air flow through the condenser. The foam allows you to create a sort of "suction" on the condenser that otherwise would not exist.
 

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Has anyone tried this on a B swap? I'm assuming you could accomplish this with a CRV or Del Sol VTEC bracket.
 

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Very interesting thread. What are the specs on this parallel flow condenser? Also other parts you upgraded? By that I mean are they all listed for a CRX?
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
The evaporator, drier, expansion valve are all just new (aftermarket) OEM style replacements for the CRX/Civic. The evap can be had for about $50 shipped on eBay (GPD brand is generally cheapest), drier and expansion valve should be about $10-15 each.

The condenser is also just listed as a stock CRX/Civic replacement. HOWEVER - the parallel flow condenser is NOT commonly labeled as parallel flow. These parallel flow aftermarket stock replacement units just started appearing in the past few years kind of out of the blue. The only way you would know as the buyer that it's parallel flow is by its appearance.

Interestingly, the parallel flow ones are actually cheaper than the OEM style serpentines. Also, the image product you buy online might even sometimes be a serpentine version but they'll send you a parallel flow version instead. I can confirm for sure that if you buy the "Pro" brand # 7014236 you will receive a parallel flow unit. I can also confirm for sure that if you buy the condenser sold by "Radiator Classic" on eBay, that one is also definitely a parallel flow unit.

These condensers can be had for about $50 shipped on eBay. Some vendors sell the same condenser in black but I am positive they all come from the same manufacturer. Wherever you get it from, here is what the parallel flow unit looks like (notice the sides of the unit are cylindrical and it has the long cylindrical top pipe). If it looks like this, it's parallel flow:

 

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Thanks for all that info. I remember a couple years ago I read about the advantages of parallel flow condensers, but I don't remember if the one he bought stated it was CRX fitment or if he just found one that fit. I will need to see if the evap and expansion valve are the same in the EF8, I know the dryer isnt but since I will need custom lines made anyways I will just use the DC one I have for mock up and be able to replace it easily.

Can't wait to get AC in the EF :)b
 

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I cant seem to find the same prices as you, here is a condenser i found using your part number
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/A-C-Condenser-Co ... 97&vxp=mtr

A little higher price than yours but was that the one you bought? The rest that came up when searching "7014236" are quite a bit more

Cheapest evaporator I found is here
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/NEW-AC-Evaporato ... ac&vxp=mtr

The only expansion valve i was able to find is here
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/NEW-EXPANSION-VA ... 34&vxp=mtr

Maybe these links will help others, or we can put a better list together
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Are you in Canada? It appears you're searching eBay Canada?

My price estimates are in U.S. dollars. No clue what you should expect to pay in Canada. But assuming we are talking American dollars, my listed prices are easily found with only a tiny amount of effort. Here are current listings I found in not even 10 seconds each.

$12 expansion valve:

http://m.ebay.com/itm/181586450752?nav=SEARCH

$13 drier:

http://m.ebay.com/itm/111648329476?nav=SEARCH

$47 evaporator:

http://m.ebay.com/itm/400896141604?nav=SEARCH

$49 parallel flow condenser:

http://m.ebay.com/itm/400759951723?nav=SEARCH
 

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Hmm maybe you're right, I did search ebay.ca but was looking at USD. Maybe its an option for people to select if they wanted their ads listed on the .ca site or not. Either way, thanks for the links :)b
 

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Any ideas on how to do this with a B swap ? I currently have a innovative AC bracket to mount the TR70 to the B series block. I also did new drier, o rings, expansion valve, PF condensor, cleaned and flushed all lines. I get great vent temps but I suspect my TR70 to be leaking. Instead of going the route of a new TR70 every year or two I would love to try this out.
 

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R134a conversions are real bad for R12 cars. The molecules are smaller than R12 and if there any kind of small leak in the system, it will escape.
Try R12a Red tek or good luck trying to find R12 !
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Robb said:
R134a conversions are real bad for R12 cars. The molecules are smaller than R12 and if there any kind of small leak in the system, it will escape.
Try R12a Red tek or good luck trying to find R12 !
Are you talking to me or the guy above your post?

If you're talking to me, this setup includes all new Goodyear Galaxy barrier hose. No factory hoses are being re-used in any capacity - only the hard fittings. Obviously I would not do this without going with R134 barrier hose. ALL new purchase AC hose is barrier hose, and has been for a long time. I even noticed that the R12 EG sedans I've cut fittings off of at the junkyard had barrier hose. It would actually take some work I would think for somebody to buy old R12 non-barrier hose.

And I have a 50 lb cylinder of R12 8)
 
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