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We has society grant cops a certain amount of authority to make calls on how much force is to be used. For we find their job difficult and dangerous. Unfortunitly very few people respecet that, and respect that authority. I like how they always show these videos halfway through, and you never see what was leading up to these criminals getting the **** beat out of them. For the record I don't like cops, for the most part, but I do respect them, and their decisions to use force.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Yeah Im with you I would like to see the full video or maybe there isnt one I guess this happened a couple of months ago but since it was put on youtube it has now started an investigation. According to the What "I" see is two police officers in a 20 sec video on stradled on his lower section the other with a knee to his upper chest throat area. You can here the guy go "i cant breathe" a couple times so since the guy will not calmly out his hands out to be cuffed he gets repeatedly beat in the face by a closed fist. Now that is what I see based on 20 secs of video. I dont know what happened before or after this but that 20 sec looks bad.
 

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yeah that does look like a bit much to me but since u cant see what is leading up to it......i say who cares......for all we know that guy is a child abuser or drug dealer........there are certain ppl who deserve exsessive force and usually if ur on the ground in that position then either u were running or fighting........if the guy was cooperatin he would have been laying on his stomach with his hands spread apart
 

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but still, they had him down and contorled. was they any need to contuine to beat the hell out of him.

Now that the moral side of me was heard, street justices is the only good kind of way to deal with things sometimes.
 

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Did you see the "Harsh Times" movie that just came out?
If you haven't been concerned with what kind of people get to enforce the law in your area, you might become so, after watching it.....

Christian Bale is scarily believable in it...
 

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I'll agree that the context of the situation is needed to judge if the force was warrented, but if someone was suffocating you by putting their weight on your neck, wouldn't you try to push them off? It looked to me like that's exactly what the guy was trying to do. On the other hand, if the guy really couldn't breathe, how could he speak?
And punching the guy in the face when they already have him pinned down? Was the officer trying to drive the suspect into unconciousness? If not, it seems like that would only aggrivate or drive him into a further state of panic.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
bobski said:
I'll agree that the context of the situation is needed to judge if the force was warrented, but if someone was suffocating you by putting their weight on your neck, wouldn't you try to push them off? It looked to me like that's exactly what the guy was trying to do. On the other hand, if the guy really couldn't breathe, how could he speak?
And punching the guy in the face when they already have him pinned down? Was the officer trying to drive the suspect into unconciousness? If not, it seems like that would only aggrivate or drive him into a further state of panic.
Yeah if someone was sufficating you or making it very hard to breathe I could very well see the guy panicing and no matter who was on your chest trying to push them off or repositioning yourself.

And "Harsh Times" I will look into it.
 

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dont get me wrong that does look bad and it was a bit much........but i think u guys are forgetting that for him to be on the ground in that position in the first place means he was either running or fighting with them beofre the footage u see........
 

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Mark, this is not what I was trying to convey.
I understand, movies dramatize stuff, create a "showie" reality, but I can tell one thing, the similarity of Cristian Bale's character, to a person I personally know, features, mannerisms, so much ... was very spooky to me.
Thinking of everything that character could do IF he got into the force is scary.

And yes, the movie is NOT about police brutality at all.
I think you might enjoy going out tonight and watching it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Heres more from the AP

CBS/AP) Video footage posted on YouTube.com showing a police officer repeatedly striking a suspect in the face during an arrest three months ago has triggered an FBI investigation.

The video shows two officers holding down William Cardenas, 24, on a Hollywood street as one punches him several times in the face before they are able to handcuff him. The struggling suspect yells repeatedly "I can't breathe!"

The footage, shot by an area resident, came to the FBI's attention Thursday, prompting investigators to open a civil rights inquiry into the Aug. 11 incident, agency spokeswoman Laura Eimiller said.

A Superior Court commissioner who viewed the video nearly two months ago and heard the officers' testimony has already found that their conduct was "more than reasonable" under the circumstances because Cardenas was resisting, the Los Angeles Times reported Friday.

The police department has begun its own criminal and administrative investigations into the officers' use of force, said police spokesman Lt. Paul Vernon.

The officers were identified as Alexander Schlegel and Patrick Farrell. Both have been reassigned to administrative work.

"There's no denying that the video is disturbing," Chief William Bratton said at a news conference. "But as to whether the actions of the officers were appropriate in light of what they were experiencing and the totality of the circumstances is what the investigation will determine."

Vernon said Cardenas is a known gang member who had been wanted on a felony warrant for receiving stolen property.

In an arrest report obtained by The Associated Press, the officers said they tried to arrest Cardenas as he and two others were drinking beer on a sidewalk.

Cardenas ran and the officers caught up to him, tripped him and swarmed over him to apply handcuffs, the report said.

The officers described repeated blows to the suspect's face in the report, as well as his efforts to resist, and their concern that he might grab one of their guns during the brawl.

"The suspect's hand covered my partner's gun holster so I yelled at my partner to watch his gun. My partner responded by capping his gun and delivering a left elbow to the suspect's face causing the suspect to let go of him," the report said.

With Cardenas still resisting, one officer used pepper spray on him, but that had "little effect," the report said. The officers were only able to handcuff him after two of his friends arrived and told him to stop fighting, according to the report.

Cardenas suffered cuts and bruises on his arms, leg and face, and received stitches on an eyelid. His attorney, B. Kwaku Duren, accused the officers of violating his client's civil rights and claimed department investigators were stalling.

"I think the LAPD is being caught covering up an obvious excessive use of force," he said.

Cardenas, who was held without bail, faces charges of resisting arrest.

I dont know this day and age this could go either way. Either the guy was definately fighting just like they said or the officers hopped up on adrenaline got carried away. Or also some of both. I guess this goes to trial on the 20th. Oh and I didnt know the movie "Harsh Times" times was new I will watch it this weekend.
 

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daveb91 said:
Yeah but one bad cop can make alot look bad. Its called trust one bad cop or a cop having a bad day so he hits a guy in the face because he had troubles at home can ruin a communities trust to the dept.
That's making a whole lot of assumptions.

If the cops get in any trouble I will certainly be disgusted with our society. I can't muster any sympathy for a criminal. I don't care about some punches to the face. It's not like his face was getting carved with a hunting knife, then I might wince just a bit.

The criminal element has NO respect for the everyday citizen (us). Why should I have any more than the most minimal respect for him? The blue is who we hire to help us protect our freedoms from these poop stains.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
MarkWilliamson said:
On the other side of that, cops are letting fear of review get in the way of doing basic officer safety. We are so afraid of getting sued or IA'd that we often hesitate. And that can be deadly.
Its called checks and balances. I personally say thank God for video and the the watch groups that monitor ths stuff.
 

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think about it this way........if both a cop and a bad guy has a gun who wins??.......because of ppl who wanna sue the cop hesitates for fear of being viewed as "in the wrong" but the bad guy doesnt........now a killer is on the lose and carjacks u on ur morning commute to work and all u can do is complain that the cops haven't caught him yet.........sounds to me like ppl need to cut the cops some slack and allow them the occasional laps in judgement cuz its their life is in the balance and when they have to make choices in that kind of situation they are gonna get out of hand occasionally
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
MarkWilliamson said:
Just like Rodney King, you don't see the pursuit and reckless driving, you don't hear the verbal commands. Sadly, those guy WERE within policy, delivering controlled strikes. Rodney just kept getting up, not oberying commands.
Man that was a bad beating too 4 officers delivering the beating and
22 others watching. I think we all followed that one. King got paid.
 
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