[mithuth]

I'm posting this more for a friend than myself. He's got a ZC that I want to pick up, but he's getting gunshy about selling it since his dad's 92-95 Vx needs an engine. (I'm not posative on the year, but i know the model is a Vx.)

I've tried to explain to him the woes of going from OBD1 to an OBD0, but he's determined that it's a simple swap. Once I explained to him about the hydro tranny, all the wiring etc, he decided he'd rather have a B18c5 (USDM GSR if I remember correctly.)

Anyhow, since it's not my swap, I don't want to put weeks of research into it. I was hoping someone here could give me a good site or two that deals in the enging/tranny package so I can point him in the right direction.

I know, I know, it's not a CRX thread, but in the long run, it helps get my CRX a ZC, so in a way it's very CRX related... sort of. lol

 

[RamaCrx]

Hmotorsonline.com

Nippon-motors.com

Both great sources for swaps. Have him call them up. Very helpful.

 

[Baker]

Hmotorsonline.com

Nippon-motors.com

Both great sources for swaps. Have him call them up. Very helpful.

Right on...

Once I explained to him about the hydro tranny, all the wiring etc, he decided he'd rather have a B18c5 (USDM GSR if I remember correctly.)

B18C5 is a USDM Type R motor, which i beleive is OBD2

 

[ludesrv]

B18C5 is a USDM Type R motor, which i beleive is OBD2

Engine OBD really doesn't matter. All of honda sensors are the same from 88-00 pretty much. The dizzy, injectors and ECU are the only things that changed with the OBD, so those are what you need to be careful about.

 

[mattminerDOTcom]

B18C5 are overpriced man, he should be looking for a B18C1 for about half the price.

[email protected]

 

[ludesrv]

B18C5 are overpriced man, he should be looking for a B18C1 for about half the price.

[email protected]

Things people forget about the C1 vs. the C5 debate.

C1 uses a GSR intake manifold. Any replacement costs alot of money (300$ or so), and are only for the P72 head. P73 head is exactly the same as a PR3 head, alot more parts available used for it, thus making it cheaper. But there is no need to replace the stock P73 IM.

P73 pistons > P72 pistons. P73 cams > P72 cams.

ITR tranny >>> GSR tranny...

I know the C5 is a dual spring head, I don't know if all the C1 are dual spring heads. I beleive the older gens (94-95 ish) aren't.

Yes, the price of 2000$ may seem like alot. But if you aren't into modding the engine itself, an ITR is the better choice. 1500-2000$ can give you an extra 30hp, factory.

 

[mithuth]

I looked em up for him and when Icalled him and told him he's looking at 4500-7000 he hung up on me. lol.

I'm guessing he don't want one now. LOL!

 

[mattminerDOTcom]

I guess if you are leaving it bone stock then, sure, consider dropping all that extra cash.

otherwise

i paid $190 for my S2 intake manifold, from a major online vendor.

The ITR tranny MAY be better then the GSR tranny, depending on what you want to do with it. If you are ever going to boost it, id much rather have the gsr tranny. And not have P73 pistons

Half the valvetrain on my 94 c1 is identical. I swapped the non identical half to ITR stuff and installed ITR LMAs for about $200.

Besides the intake manifold, everythign in the head is readily available and interchangeable. cams, valvetrain, etc all swap freely between them.

You also are alot more likley to actually find a GSR motor for sale....

but i guess it just depends on whether or not 30(engine)hp and shorter gearing is worth a couple grand whicih relaly comes down to if you are leaving it stock, or going to be upgrading it later.

[email protected]

 

[ludesrv]

^^^ Again, most people don't boost. So they would want P73 pistons and P73 cams.

Yes alot of the head is interchangeable. But you had to do the work. If he doesn't know how, it's costly to do so, more then buying an ITR engine.

And around here ITR engines cost 4500-5000$ complete. GSR cost 3000-3500$ complete. So there you go, I'd get an ITR anyday.

 

[mattminerDOTcom]

cool. so its basically a your mileage may vary type deal. at least all the facts are there. in my eyes i can put together a ITR killer GSR motor on the ITR budget, even NA.

but youre right, some people cant do it themselves, or dont want to.

pricing in my area is more skewed in favor of the GSR as well

many factors to consider i guess.

[email protected]

 

[bubba]

If you wanna save money just take an LS motor (B18A or B) and put either a B16, GSR or ITR head on it.

 

[mattminerDOTcom]

If you wanna save money just take an LS motor (B18A or B) and put either a B16, GSR or ITR head on it.

to do that properly, you will end up approaching the cost of a GSR motor....

while it IS a valid option, you are then stuck with the inferior bottom end of an LS AND you need a good amount of skill to properly build that motor in the first place.

still an option though.

[email protected]

 

[ludesrv]

If you wanna save money just take an LS motor (B18A or B) and put either a B16, GSR or ITR head on it.

to do that properly, you will end up approaching the cost of a GSR motor....

while it IS a valid option, you are then stuck with the inferior bottom end of an LS AND you need a good amount of skill to properly build that motor in the first place.

still an option though.

[email protected]

Very true. LS bottoms ends weren't designed to rev past 7000-7500rpm. Pushing them higher is risky. Most VTEC heads are designed to be safely brought up to 8500rpm. You risk destroying your bottom end by throwing a rod with shear force. Plus the lack of VTEC oil passages forces you to run an LS vtec conversion kit, which could give you serious oil issues if not done right. Honestly, LS vtecs are not worth the time or money, that's my opinion tho.

 

[mithuth]

I looked em up for him and when Icalled him and told him he's looking at 4500-7000 he hung up on me. lol.

I'm guessing he don't want one now. LOL!

:closed:

 

[Dodo]

So correct me if im wrong, but, a GSR is better then a Ls (not an option i was looking at) A type R is better then a GSR only if not boost but cost alot more, You can get the same power out of a GSR as a type R for half the cost.

Im i mostly right in saying that.

 

[RamaCrx]

Remember a Dart Block costs about $1500. Not all that much more than getting a block b18c1 or c5 and then putting in new internals.

 

[Baker]

B18C5 is a USDM Type R motor, which i beleive is OBD2

Engine OBD really doesn't matter. All of honda sensors are the same from 88-00 pretty much. The dizzy, injectors and ECU are the only things that changed with the OBD, so those are what you need to be careful about.

I was just stating that he would want to stay OBD1 and that the C5 is the R motor and is OBD2.

 

[ollie]

Remember a Dart Block costs about $1500. Not all that much more than getting a block b18c1 or c5 and then putting in new internals.

$1500? where are you buying from? Mine cost $2K and I think $1900 was the lowest price I've seen.

Mith:As far as that GSR swap it doesnt take $3000 to have one installed.
I don't know what price gougers you guys deal with,but I can find local GSR longblocks for around $1200-1500 and a trans for around $400.
Actually the price on GSR swaps has dropped over the years.

Now if I could I'd buy a C5 and enjoy life,but at that price I'm nearing a K swap territory....sorry I know now I'm rambling.. :lol:

 

[RamaCrx]

I went back and looked. You're right. Dart block now more like 2000. Was less when I checked about a year ago when I was dreaming.

 

[mithuth]

He backed out when he saw the pricing. All he kept saying was "too much, what else?"

So I told him to go look for himself, I wasn't doing his ****** work.