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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Heres why you should make sure you get your cal aligned and your toe dialed in when you lower your car. Especially after matt installs your coilovers and tells you to go an dget your car aligned.

the effects:





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Nice. I always recommend alignments after suspension work. The amount of people that actually go is quite low. I can't wait for spring to arrive for summer 07 alignment :) .
 

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Dont you mean Camber???

But yes, alignment is key.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
on that, i can agree with you wholeheartedly....im an alignment geek. I align my cars to very specific specs.

that car i did the best i could with no alignemnt tools, it wouldve been even worse if i did nothing.

with my current alignment on my crx and the integra i had my wheels on previous i went through my current tires with almost no abnormal wear.

they are maybe 10 percent more worn on the inside then the out, but i run a good amount of - camber in the front.

with the toe and caster dialed in perfect it allows you to run lots of camber with minimal wear.

toe....teh evil tire eater.

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Dodo said:
Dont you mean Camber???
NO, camber has maybe a 5% effect versus the 95% that wore those tires.
Incorrrect toe adjustment can eat a set of tires like that in a matter of weeks.
I have no camber adjustments on my black car, it's dropped almost 2" has noticable camber issues but I've set the toe and after a year the tires wear flat accross.
Camber only puts more weight on the inside of the tire, whereas toe-out DRAGS the inside of the tires accross the roads.
 

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Damn, were those tires on the Imprezza? How many miles did that take?

Since there is really no camber or caster adjustment on out race I always align the toe on my car myself and I've gone tens of thousands of mile with normal wear (and some negative camber). i think laser alignments are overrated. Although I would prob get it laser aligned if I weren't such a cheap bastard. And I'd actually like to get a little more negative camber in the rear of my car.

Aside from tire wear, I think that an incorrect toe alignment has more drastic effects on handling. Toe out makes it jittery and jerk, the car wants to turn every which way, whereas tow in, while less noticeable, makes it a little harder to handle.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
the impreza has moderate toe in on the front.

if you look at the other 2 tires (Ill post pics), with no toe issues and EVEN MORE camber, they are worn about the same on the outside, but even all the way across.

it took awhile, but im not sure exaclty mileage wise...ill try to caulate it out.

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Oh yeah, alignment's important, got to fix that toe...

I learned this the hard way too. One set of Kumho Ecsta Supras gone in 6 months, put new tires and an alignment at the top of my to-do list.

I've got -3.5 degrees front camber, and with zero toe, camber wear really isn't an issue.
 

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I'll back up the camber/toe argument...

I have a lot of camber in the front, and almost none in the rear now. I used to have 0 toe front and rear, with ~3* of camber each, no premature tire wear (I got over 10k out of my RT-215s). When I installed the SPC LCAs in the back, I reduced the rear camber to 0.5 degrees, but Honda couldn't get the rear toe in further than 0.5* out. The compensator arms were maxxed out, I need to notch them. or use some adjustable toe links. Anyway, when I took my RT-615s off for the winter after about 2000 miles of use, they were showing inner wear on the rears only. Not extreme, but noticable. So low camber and some toe in the rear, worn tires. High camber and 0 toe up front, normal wear.
 

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Ok, but, if we werent all running high (or low) camber, wouldnt the whole tire be showing wear? With zero camber, the whole contact patch should be on the pavement causing the whole tire to wear evenly. At least this is how i was tought (not by school yet).
 

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Dodo, the point we are trying to mke is that with a small amount of camber, like say -3degrees the tire deforms under the car's weight so that the entire width of the tire is contacting the ground. Because there is compressed air in your tire, the force due to the pressure in the tire is approx equal across that contact patch. There is more force on the inside thatn the outsid ein this instance due to the forced deformity of the tire, but its really not that much. it also does increase the rlling friction in the insid ea littl ebit, but again, not too much. I'm sure the condition is worstened when you use a lower profile tire as the sidewalls are stiffer and thus prevent the tire from deforming as easily, thus causing slightly more wear on the inner side due to camber. but overall because the inner side only wears say 10% faster, you really aren't losing any overall service life from your tire.
 

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With a title like that, I was expecting a pic of something other than tires. :twisted: :twisted:

Also, take the tire off the rim, and move ot to the opposite side, and you got a fresh set of tires. lol
 

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jfrolang said:
mithuth said:
With a title like that, I was expecting a pic of something other than tires. :twisted: :rolleyes1: :twisted:
It was exactly what I expected. I just re-read the title, and the only other thing I can come up with is setting the bone in a broken toe?
I cant say what I was thinking and remain PG. :twisted:
 

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Yeah, I have had my car lowered for about a year now, and havent had it aligned, I go through tires all the time, one of these days I think I will get it done, Im tired of replacing tires.
 

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I've had nearly -3 on my autocross and daily driver cars for years now with zero toe. I've never had more than marginal inside tire wear...maybe 1/16th difference from the outside at the very end of a tires life.

Toe...she is the keeler of tires.
 

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Dodo said:
Ok, but, if we werent all running high (or low) camber, wouldnt the whole tire be showing wear? With zero camber, the whole contact patch should be on the pavement causing the whole tire to wear evenly. At least this is how i was tought (not by school yet).
Kind of, if nothing flexed/moved and sidewalls had no give. But wih toe-out as the car rolls forward the tires are trying to roll away from each other but the car/suspension keeps them from doing that so the inside edge is pulled down more and now has more force on it than the outside edge which is now being lifted just a bit. I hope that makes sense.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
yup. well sorry to let you all down with the pics hah. I thought it was pretty graphic for a car forum. thats the equivalent to torturing your tires!

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